Gun smith said , not head spaced properly. The ramps on the regular rifle-type extension are cut just to the edge of the extension. Share it in the comments section. If your magazines are set up correctly, and the feed lip edges polished smooth, each round fed from the magazine will go directly into the chamber. While this gun is a more of novelty build than a "serious use" AR, I intend to use good parts and want it to run as well as my other ARs. Barrels are Douglas 416 stainless steel with 1-7 twist with M4 feed ramps An older-version (or A2-style) feed ramp is cut only on the barrel extension itself (top). You can post now and register later. M4 16", SBN, 1:7, 5.56 NATO Barrel Specifications: - Caliber: 5.56 NATO (.223 REM) - Gas Tube: Car Add to Cart. Change the angle so that the ramp ends at the exact same point. which is basicallly an m16a1 cut down. I didn't forsee that we'd ever see the day when replacement parts would be so hard to get. Watch a video about our Modern Series AR barrel: You want them to match. The reason I decided to write about this topic at all was because there are some mil-spec features advertised on aftermarket parts that arent even really mil-spec. Its also recommended you polish the ramps once youve achieved the appropriate angle. UPPER RECEIVER: AR-15 Mil-Spec Machined out of 7075-T6 Forged Aluminum, M4 Feed Ramps, Cerakoted Magpul Flat Dark Earth (FDE) Color with Forward Assist and Ejection Port Cover Installed BARREL: 22 inch, 223 Wylde Caliber, 4150 CMV, 1:7 Twist, Heavy Bull Barrel Profile, Straight Fluted, Melonite/Nitride Finish - made for us by Tactical Kinetics HAND -The Barrel MUST be removed from the Upper Receiver in order to use this Kit.-Never cut or polish the aluminum M4 Feed Ramps in your upper receiver! Does it make a big difference? You CAN modify a rifle/A2 barrel extension to an M4 style extension, but it isn't always the best way to go unless you just have to do it. Thats receivers, bolts, and on down the list of the 100 or so parts that can make up an AR-15. Would not feed to save its life! I recently built an AR9 (Glock Mags) that has been running flawlessly for about 3-400rds. You can run M4 cut barrels with rifle receivers, but not the other way around as it will create at catch that can hang up the bullets. The M4 cut extends down beyond the edge of the barrel extension (has a scalloped appearance), and a correspondingly deeper cut in an M4-spec upper receiver effectively extends the ramps downward (they're lowered). M4 ramps help in feeding in for carbine in full auto. I've thought about it myself, and I'd like to see test results if any exist, displaying what reliability effect M4 ramps have on other barrel lengths. The tip of the cartridge rarely comes into contact with the upper receiver. Powered by Invision Community. I have seen it done many, MANY times and if done right, it works/functions 100% without issue. It's best to use rifle/rifle combo or M4/M4. The rifle-platform M16s dont use them. are all barrels w/ m4 feed ramps?? Modern Series Barrels. It's not worth changing the barrel extension on an already finished barrel, getting the new barrel extension to line up correctly with the gas port will probably cost more in gunsmithing/machining fees than buying a new barrel. Check often for fit. Im an old vet, now retired and looking to build some ARs as a hobby to keep me doing something that I will enjoy. The barrel Throat is the second most critical component after angles and should be polished with utmost care. Rifles, Uppers, Lowers, Barrels, and more, [ARCHIVED THREAD] - Rifle vs m4 feed ramps, http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q125/PursuitSS/Postings%20photos/c0d26170b75c3e6f9ea65a7d0862247e.jpg. The M4, and the CAR-15, before it have had similar problems like the ones you mentioned. again, Thanks. Id just get one for that barrel and find a barrel with m4 extension for the upper you already have. 338 and others not the .308 76251 or 6.5 creedmore which o think should have a.30cal feed ramp.? Don't forget read more information about it here! 1 is a standard and the other for use with m4 feed ramp barrels. We want you, our readers, to be able to make informed decisions. The M4 was the first (allegedy) carbine length gas system. Metal cases ammunition such as Wolf through an M4 clone? BEFORE YOU GO MODIFYING IT, check your headspace.I have a Gibbz upper in my junk drawer because the upper -- for some reason -- wouldn't allow a perfectly good bolt (as checked by Criterion) to headspace correctly on a Criterion barrel, with the bolt installed in the carrier. Founded by Frank Galli in 2000, Snipers Hide has been offering informational videos, podcasts, and other support to its users in one location. You have a rifle barrel. [ARCHIVED THREAD] - M4 feed ramp barrel in a non M4 ramp upper. It was in the last few issues of SAR. I think you will find that the tip of the bullet clears the M4 cuts in the upper receiver by a wide margin. The ramp angles are different and changing the profile of the extension doesn't make it something it isn't. So there's a lot more going on with rounds bouncing up and down in the mags etc. Anodized red parts. Higher pressure equte to parts (bcg, buffer, buffer spring, ROUNDS, etc) experiencing much higher wear/tear. All Rights Reserved. I am glad to know that I need to look for changes in design and the differences in the A2 and A4 feed ramp / rails. We're a little past that point as I already own both the barrel and receiver, both of which cant easily be replaced or swapped for a decent price. Is getting it as part of the upper better? It is milled out of 6061 T6. By the time you made it work you spent more time, money, and effort than if you just bought a new barrel or upper. . A4 Complete Upper Receiver - 7075 Forged A4 Flat Top Upper Receiver - M4 Feed Ramps Includes: - Add to Cart. For new construction barrels only. Barrel, sight and trigger work on most pistols and shotguns. I guess it depends on what your relationship to the necessary shop activities is. My alternative plan is to do exactly as you describe. Again, youll find plenty of videos on spooling up hand grinders to remedy feed ramp and ejection port issues with these larger cartridges, but I strongly suggest going factory-done aftermarket. In military situations, it is advantageous for rifles to function with damaged, worn, or less than ideally serviceable magazines. if you are OK with 3MOA, you might go 20,000 rounds! Ready to drop onto a complete lower receiver. The manufacturer said they had sold hundreds of barrels with out problems reported. http://www.ar15fornoobs.com/wp-content/uploads/feedramps.jpg. Now, theres nothing wrong at all with a little polish on any and all feed ramps, which can not only be done fairly easily, it can be successfully done by most at home. If I have a rifle ramp upper and get the barrel later and coincidentally will have an m4 ramp. EDIT: Okay, I understand now! and add them to non-m4 barrels.? For the purposes of this chapter, we'll call the new one the M4, and the old one the AR. The M4 receiver feed ramps are cut at a steeper angle and, as a result, extend down into the receiver wall. By my estimates, the tip of the bullet first hits the barrel extension about 1/3 of the way up the respective feed ramp on the barrel extension. If you consider this article useful, share it with anyone in need! I have a 723 build (w/ C7 upper) and a 727 build (A2 upper) that use 14.5" Colt M4 barrels. this is the barrel designed and profiled for the Mark 12 Mod 0 uppers and rifles. One new winner* is announced every week! I cant advise on that one folks. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. Jams and misfires. M4 feed ramps will extend the barrel extension and the upper receiver. Some gun owners believe that the M4 ramps can help for some of the larger-diameter cartridges in use. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. Barrel Length: 16" Barrel Material: 4150V Chrome Moly Vanadium Steel Barrel Finish: Phosphate Barrel Profile: M4 Chamber: 5.56 NATO Twist Rate: 1 in 7" Extension: M4 Gas System: Carbine-Length Gas Block Type: Low Profile .750" Diameter Upper Receiver: Forged 7075 T6 Aluminum Receiver Style: M4 Flat top with feed ramps Receiver Finish: Hardcoat Anodized A forum community dedicated to drag racing drivers and enthusiasts. Then the manufacturer discontinued the barrel. These units actually feature the NON-F-Marked (correct) front sight base. Feeds flawlessly. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. The information provided here does not represent the views of Cheaper Than Dirt! Shopping with us is absolutely safe - you never have to worry about credit card safety when shopping here Share your latest AR build or photos from the range with #RangeDayFriday for a chance to win a new firearm! The best case is to have both an upper and barrel that have the feed ramps. This 20" BCM barrel is machined from SS410 stainless steel. Thread: Adding M4 feedramps to A1/C7 upper. However, they do have M4 feed-ramps which is not clone correct. I have done the same, protect the Barrel extension with a layer of electrical tape and carefully file or Dremel the ramps into the aluminum receiver. Notify me of follow-up comments by email. Those ramps line up with the barrel, which are cut deeper than on a rifle barrel. The last is using the best and right ammo for the job. All uppers are assembled cleaned and tested before shipping. I had seen these pix years ago and dismissed the idea of mix and match. What's the difference? Factory said its fine . By Yamil Sued August 6, 2021. All things being equal and having used both weapons extensively, Id rather have the feed Ramps. Description Genuine 14.5" SOCOM, carbine length gas system barrel from Colt. After two months of back and forth, cleaned up the feed ramps. Given that most of us dont always have perfect access to truly genuine Mil-Spec, mil-standard parts (those actually used in issued fighting tools), were shopping based on a little part trust and a bigger part knowledge. Try this little exercise: 1. May 17, 2008 in The Armorer. When carrying out feed ramp polishing, it is crucial to prioritize the frame's angles, which is a critical part of the feed ramp. However Ive built numerous ar15 and lr308 rifles and pistols. Somwhere in the 1990s I believe, Colt designed the M4 feed ramps, where they took some of the material out of the upper receiver, cut two little ramps in it and then cut the ramps in the barrel extention a little further forward. Looking For Bear Creek Arsenal Barrels Review? I've been thinking about doing sort of an "Early Diemaco C8 carbine" clone build with a C7 style upper receiver. Olympic Arms Upper receiver with rear sight assembly and forward assist and dust cover has M4 feed ramps $260 View attachment 1016575 View attachment 1016576 Upper Receiver, A4, Flat Top, USGI, Numbered, AR-Stoner Upper Receiver Stripped AR-15 A3 Flat-Top Matte, Black River Tactical 16 Cold Hammer Forged Optimum Barrel Accuracy Evaluation. As they are becoming more and more a standard, and certainly do not do any harm to us. Feedramps, proper staking of castle nuts, forward assist (yep went there)S-happens seen it. Using an upper with M4 feed ramps with a barrel that does not have them will lead to feed problems as it creates a ledge/lip that can catch the bullet tip as it tries to feed. You wrote that much to make a point that should have taken about 100 words? This is why you can use a barrel with an extension with M4 feedramps with a receiver that does not have feedramps, but you cannot use a receiver with M4 feedramps with a barrel with an extension with rifle feedramps. Another reason is that any commercial receiver and parts makers want to tool up to make upper receivers and barrel extensions, especially when shorter guns are becoming more popular. It is removeable with a special wrench and a barrel clamp/vise. The closest brand new barrel you are likely to find is the Windham Weaponry 20 inch 1/7 twist chrome lined barrel. If it's happening regularly, check the magazines you are using for serviceability. I can assure you that most mods that deviate from the original design aren't 100% reliable. However, its rare now to find an upper receiver or a ready-to-go barrel that doesnt have the M4 cuts. The barrel is supposed to have the M4 feed ramps. Barrel customizations are also available. I picked up a side charging upper from Sundevil last year. To measure just where the round makes impact on the feed ramps, I did not use any sort of micrometer to measure. 308 m5 using m4 feed ramps, which I belive are for the smaller round like. Add 3% to the total cost for credit card purchases. LanceRiley, Since the M4 barrel is one and a half inches shorter than the minimum legal barrel you can install in an AR15, the M4 gas tube will be, of course, smaller. This gave it a longer point for the magazine to allow the rounds to come out of the magazine and feed into the chamber. Please be respectful of others. I built the upper using a Mega upper with a Compass Lake 18" barrel. practical_man Not all mil-spec features advertised on the product information are the real mil-specs. I've seen uppers with and without anodizing on M4 ramps . it seems to me to be about 50/50 with and without. Create Account; Log Out ; Log In ; Wishlist 0; Shopping Cart 0; Home; About If I was concerned with precision, I would seek out parts from well-known gun makers and customizers Baer comes to mind, Hart barrels, etc etc. upper recievers and barrels are hard to comeby. Required fields are marked *. Thats an important thing since without the feed ramps, issues can arise when receivers and barrel extensions are mismatched. "A Bad Day At The Range Is Better Than A Great Day Working". 4. Remember less is more, little by little. The rifle receiver, doesn't have ramps on the receiver, they are only cut into the barrel. aaargh.. that's the setup I hate to see. Editors Note: This article was originally published in January of 2019. Additionally, in this increasingly specialized world of AR-15 parts that we live in, there are proprietary feed ramp cuts used for some alternate cartridges, such as .458 SOCOM. "It will last 5k rounds instead of 4k. Clear editor. Most work performed while-you-wait, evening and saturday appointments available. I notice that's a Gibbz (or Gibbz-type) upper. Moreover, telling someone that an extension can be modified, while not a lie, is nothing more than mental masturbation when your post contains a caveat for having the knowledge and proper tools. I think you will find that the tip of the bullet clears the M4 cuts in the upper receiver by a wide margin. Copyright 2016 - 2023 by AdventureFootstep.com. What is an m4 feed ramp? Oh well, as I tell my lovely and understanding bride, guns are relatively free. it's the ammo and training that cost real money. FWIW one of my rifles has M4 feed ramps on the barrel and no M4 feed ramps on the upper and it has functioned just fine. ago KrinkyDink2 9 hr. Little polish. The dimensions are different between the two, so theyd have to change some things to the feed ramps dimensions. The barrels also had to be modified. Is one better than the other? The Mission of Cheaper Than Dirt! If you ever have an issue, then look at getting a correct barrel for the upper. Your email address will not be published. For use by barrel manufacturers. This USGI modification was done to both the barrel extension and the upper receiver, creating a longer and steeper feed ramp. So like ORD says it is entirely 100% possible and plenty of people do it, but I would rather not do any work to this perfect barrel. With the bcg moving that much faster, the magazine springs were having a hard time supplying the rounds fast enough, AS WELL AS the tips of the rounds were digging into the feed ramps and catching. There's no downside to having M4 feedramps on your carbine, but they are not as necessary without full auto and when using followers that will not tilt (or in a 20 AR15). Some barrels I see for sale say they include M4 feed ramps, and some uppers say they include them too. Use this M4 Barrel extention with M4 feedramps. what does it do?? colt A1E1 733 uppers didn't have extended carbine feedramps ? AR9 - Help diagnosing feeding issue. All this basically means is that the ramps continue from the barrel extension down through the upper receiver tonthe magazine. It's best to use rifle/rifle combo or M4/M4. I have looked and looked and looked. Full M4 feed ramps are on both the upper and barrel extension. I would only add the feed ramps to the receiver if I had feeding issues, which you should not have. You will be able to leave a comment after signing in, AR15Armory.com pictures would help. Reliability is the main concern for me when I re-barrel this rifle. He had more to say and added some more engineer and gun designer speak too. Issues can arise when receivers and barrel extensions are mismatched. Copyright 1996-2023 AR15.COM LLC. A feed ramp is a basic feature of many breech loading cartridge firearm designs. Feed ramps being m4 or. Interesting reading. Either way is good and both types work great with semi auto only guns. /r/ar15 is here for your favorite black gun links, build pics, questions and other tactical or practical information. . Avoid Polishing Too Lightly Or Too Roughly Inadequate knowledge about these feed ramps can lead to lots of problems with barrels because they are essential parts to guide the bullet up and into the chamber. Only took a few minutes. All NFA rules apply. Went back to the sellers website and found I was not the only one with problems. The mil actually only specs M4 feed ramps for use in its M4s. In case My barrel is rifle ramp it won't be so bad after all. instead of mil-spec. For this test, I used a Colt upper with M4 feed ramps and a SOCOM heavy 14.5 barrel, just like what is used in the military. Go slow and you'll be done in no time. JavaScript is disabled. Your link has been automatically embedded. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. FN AR15 barrels are hammer forged using the same proprietary high-grade Chrome Moly Vanadium steel used in FN's venerable machinegun barrels produced to handle the punishment of . 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